Vincent Dardel (@vdardel) on GitLab, 2018-04-02.
Some people of the community is attempting to create a list of active companies using CL in production: https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies
That may be an easier job for people behind this site, and anyway good propaganda information to add into it.
Vincent Dardel (@vdardel) on GitLab, 2018-10-05.
I see this list is integrated through https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/clo/cl-site/commit/c0b2f7a94d8d6780df5eed2bef58c71761e80a70 and https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/clo/cl-site/commit/9bca37580852379cb3b9e793fded4622264e5a78 +1!
Vincent Dardel (@vdardel) on GitLab, 2018-10-05.
similarly, libraries with the awesome-list: d359575c3f77c095c55847da09538f51019e6dfc (find a way to maintain only one ?)
Vincent Dardel (@vdardel) on GitLab, 2018-10-11.
But still, one question: can the CL foundation help build that list ? cc @dcooper
Dave Cooper (@dcooper) on GitLab, 2018-10-12.
Hi Vincent @vdardel,
Are you asking if the CLF can help build a list of Lisp companies, or libraries?
Regarding companies, I can only speak for myself. If others on the CLF (or with enough interest to view this Issue) have ideas about how the CLF as an organization can help with this, please chime in. For myself, I am aware of maybe 2-3 other companies using CL which are not on the above list, and I'm not sure if they would want to be mentioned. I can ask them next time I'm in contact with them.
As far as our own (Genworks) customers, I daresay these can be considered as CL users as well, because they are actively maintaining and developing applications based on Genworks GDL, which is a superset of CL (embedded in CL). At present however, we are under strict and standard NDAs with all our customers, as they view their use of Genworks (and by association CL) as a trade secret and competitive advantage. I can disclose that we have a single-digit number of first-level commercial customers for Genworks GDL development seats. Some of these are large companies which use their developed applications internally, and a few of them are VARs who sell-on Runtime applications. The end-users of these Runtime applications number in the hundreds of distinct customer entities, with up to 1,000 unique individual users daily. As far as users of the open-source "Gendl" variant, I cannot say, as we receive very little feedback on this. What I do know is that we've done a piss-poor job of providing documentation and compelling, low-friction starter demos/tutorials to facilitate the free system really to take off (I continue to hope this can change, and we have been taking some new initiatives in that direction lately).
Regarding libraries, I'm not sure if the CLF should be in the business of picking favorites in terms of libraries (I realize we're already doing this to an extent with the so-called "awesome list," though -- and my opinion is that the CLF should review this policy). It seems like the defacto standard list of libraries is simply everything in Quicklisp. If a library is absent from Quicklisp, while it is claimed (by its maintainers and/or users) to be "awesome" or "useful" then I would ask them to explain their absence from Quicklisp. I realize that simply referring to the Quicklisp listing doesn't present the best picture for newbies who may be overwhelmed with over 1500 libraries which are admittedly not super well indexed, categorized, or documented at present. We can hope that Quickdocs or Declt can help with this situation.
Note that Quickdocs and Declt (Quickref) are both linked from our Documentation page, and Quickref is actually hosted in-house at common-lisp.net. (incidentally, on a personal note, I've noticed that the Quickref documentation for Gendl is hopelessly missing the target and in some cases harmful -- like listing setf methods for things which never ever should be side-effected -- apparently I need to figure out how to put the right "hints" in the Gendl sources so it, and Quickdocs, will generate reasonable documentation for us).
Anyway, regarding the library situation -- does anyone know how other languages help their new (and old) users sort through their library ecosystem? If I were using Python and wanted to generate HTML, is there one and only one way to do that? If so, who decides that one way - what if someone wants to publish/use/support/promote an alternative way?
Vincent Dardel (@vdardel) on GitLab, 2018-10-14.
I was asking about companies, because I suppose the CLF has contact with professionals, or is in the best position to be, for example when it sets up meetings and conferences. It would be helpful if professionals like you tried to expand the list.
I realize that simply referring to the Quicklisp listing doesn't present the best picture for newbies who may be overwhelmed with over 1500 libraries which are admittedly not super well indexed, categorized, or documented at present. We can hope that Quickdocs or Declt can help with this situation.
Exactly. In my experience, it is absolutely necessary to give pointers. The awesome-list on github is an attempt. It's good there's a page on the website now. It isn't advertised as the CLF's choice, so that's ok.
IMO other languages do this with lots of blog posts, talks and famous, superactive library authors.
There is no one and only one way to do this in python and no official one.
Erik Huelsmann (@ehuelsmann) on GitLab, 2018-10-14.
I was asking about companies, because I suppose the CLF has contact with professionals, or is in the best position to be,
True. The list of Lisp companies is an attempt to address this. The question is: what's missing in that list which fails to make it appealing to you? Because most (well-known) of the interesting stories / companies are on that list.
for example when it sets up meetings and conferences. It would be helpful if professionals like you tried to expand the list.
Agreed. There's a mailing list for Common Lisp professionals, btw: pro at common dash lisp dot net. Maybe it's an idea to post there with a targetted / well-defined question which provokes clear answers which can be directly incorporated in the site?
Vincent Dardel (@vdardel) on GitLab, 2018-10-14.
what's missing in that list which fails to make it appealing to you?
I like this list, it's just it wasn't built by the CLF but by newbies !! so I suppose the CLF could add more.
Because most (well-known) of the interesting stories / companies are on that list.
or not :S
+1 for the mailing list, thanks.
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